What is your background? What led you to the role of Director of the Amsterdam Law Practice?

'As a lecturer in international law at Radboud University in Nijmegen, I taught and coordinated the Moot Court International Law course. I also designed a course in which students simulated the UN Security Council. I noticed that students became extremely enthusiastic about these types of courses and learned a lot from them, growing both professionally and personally.

This type of education is often seen primarily as practical skills training. However, I realised that it offered much more to students than that. I found this interesting. At Amsterdam Law Practice, experiential education is embedded in a pedagogical vision of learning through action and reflection. That's why I applied for the ALP coordinator position 5 years ago. I have now taken over from Anniek de Ruijter, the driving force behind the establishment of ALP.'

What appeals to you most about ALP's educational vision?

'Firstly, this programme enables students to discover their relationship with the law and observe how it works in practice. They really step into the role of a lawyer. Once you have experienced that, you can determine how you relate to clients, opposing parties and the law, and what kind of lawyer you want to be.

This can only be achieved through reflection on practical experience. At ALP, students learn to consider their future role in light of professional ethics. I often hear that this education makes students realise what the role of a lawyer looks like in practice for the first time, which helps them determine their career path.'

What opportunities do you see for the further development of ALP?

'In recent years, the role and choices of lawyers have become highly visible in events such as the benefits scandal, the Groningen gas dossier, child removals and the Panama Papers. This demonstrates that the choises you make as a lawyer matter.

I believe that the current climate calls for an educational approach that provides students with insight into these choices and ways to navigate ethical dilemmas. This is an important opportunity for ALP in the coming years.'

What kind of student were you during your law degree?

'I was a serious and somewhat shy student. I found it very exciting to take part in negotiations or mock court hearings. I noticed that these experiences made me more passionate about my studies, and my shyness gradually faded away. Ultimately, it was those activities that determined my decision to specialise in international law.'

You are also a confidential advisor. How does this help you in your work for ALP?

'I haven't officially been a confidential advisor for very long, but as coordinator of the internship course, I often fulfilled a similar role. For example, when students experienced something unpleasant during their internship.

In experiential education in particular, it is important that students feel at ease. They must be able to experiment freely, dare to make mistakes and engage in personal reflection. Only then can they truly learn from each other.'